# ,  / > Ten-Tec >  ORION II...

## DRUID 3

.
http://foto.cqham.ru/showphoto.php?photo=1403&size=big
       .

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## DRUID 3

:Very Happy:   ... ,  ...   :  :

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## RW3PS

.

-----------------------------------
Ten Tec Orion  2 years on  Bob Henderson, 5B4AGN

Its now a full two years since I reviewed Ten Tecs Orion for Focus. Time then, for a look at how Orion has developed and how my feelings for it have changed with experience. 

As we all know, manufacturers specifications can be seriously misleading. Usually this is not a consequence of what they tell us but rather, what they dont. For my money, third order IMD dynamic range (IMD3DR) is the most telling specification, when considering how a receiver will perform in a strong signal environment. The key to evaluating manufacturers claims for IMD3DR performance is to pay attention to the frequency displacement of the two interfering signals used in making this measurement. An impressive IMD3DR at 50kHz spacing will provide only cold comfort during a contest, where within a 50kHz bandwidth there are likely to be over a hundred monstrously strong signals. What matters more, is how a receiver performs with close-in interference. 

At 102dB* I believe the Icom IC7800 has the best IMD3DR measured at 20kHz displacement of any commercially manufactured amateur transceiver. Orion, though still impressive at 20kHz, trails this by 6dB at 96dB*. What is much more important however is what happens when IMD3DR is measured at much narrower displacement. At 2kHz, Icoms IC7800 deteriorates a full 22 dB to only 80dB*, whereas deterioration on Ten Tecs Orion is just 3dB falling to 93dB*. So when it comes to avoiding having to listen to that indecipherable code near the noise floor, the audible consequence of inadequate IMD3DR performance, Orion leads the IC7800 by a full 13dB. Orion continues to hold the crown for the best overall signal handling performance of any commercially manufactured amateur bands transceiver. 

As I write this piece, I am unaware of any commercial transceiver closer on Orions heals in this regard than the IC7800. That such an expensive radio should fall so far behind Orion for close-in signal handling, is a direct consequence of the up-conversion architecture adopted by Japanese manufacturers. This approach has been avoided by Ten Tec with good reason and to good effect. 

My Orions have had almost daily use since I bought them. Neither has suffered any hardware failure during that time. Aside from the poor tactile feedback provided by the front panel momentary switches and the lack of colour in the 115 x 85mm display, I can find little to be critical about in day to day use. There is however a shortcoming in the deployment of narrow roofing filters, which does detract from the full hardware potential of Orion, in certain circumstances. This largely arises through Ten Tecs decision to re-use the first IF filter set from the Omni range in Orion. This sadly was a mistake. Use of these filters in the optional 500Hz and 250Hz roofer slots causes significant deterioration in close in IMD3DR. Consequently, deployment of these filters in Orion is largely undesirable. This has been addressed in Orion 2, which has a completely new set of roofing filters, appropriately designed for the task. In the current form, these cannot be deployed in Orion but there has been suggestion an upgrade kit might be made available. Time will tell. 

Currently, the optimum roofing filter configuration for CW use in Orion, as opposed to Orion 2, requires purchase of an additional 600Hz roofer from Inrad. This must be installed in place of the stock 1kHz filter, which continues to be useful if transferred to the vacant 1.8kHz slot. Such is possible unless you already have an optional 1.8kHz filter installed in that location. Deployment of the 4-pole Inrad 600Hz roofer in Orion will yield substantially the same performance as should be available with Orion 2, with the exception that Orion 2 also offers an optional 300Hz filter. Use of the 300Hz filter in Orion 2 should provide further enhancement of very close-in IMD3DR, whilst at the same time sharpening narrow bandwidth skirts. So far however, I have seen no lab test reports which either confirm the realisation of this or otherwise. 

Ten Tecs Orion 2 started shipping in December. There are three main differences between Orion and Orion 2 (ignoring price). The first is the introduction of a colour TFT display, which replaces the black & white unit used in Orion. This change is largely cosmetic but significantly improves the look and feel of Orion. Of course, it also adds clarity to the information readout provided. The second is the new roofing filter scheme, which hopefully will have avoided the IMD3DR deterioration seen when using narrow filters in Orion. The third is replacement of the main processor by the more powerful Motorola Freescale Dragonball Super VZ chip. This applies greater horsepower to the housekeeping tasks carried out within Orion 2 and should yield noticeable improvement in response speed to commands issued from front panel controls and those via RS-232.

There is no doubt Ten Tec did a great job with Orion hardware and the three significant changes found in Orion 2 are welcome enhancements. All the more disappointing then, that Orion operating code has failed to match the very high standard set by the hardware.

Early in 2005 Ten Tec embarked upon a complete rewrite of the Orion code. This was brought about due to problems in the architecture of the original code, which Ten Tec engineering felt limited the extent to which performance might be enhanced. These limitations affected both response speed and overall system stability. At that time the official release of operating software was V1.372.

It is a rather sad and disappointing fact that after a full year of development, the released V2 operating code is inferior in several dimensions to V1.

From my own perspective, my greatest disappointment is with QSK performance. V1.372 never made Orion a star performer as a QSK radio, though it was adequate for use up to around 35 wpm. Beyond that, T/R recovery was just too slow. Discussions with Ten Tec engineering, early last year, raised significant hope for improvement in QSK performance with V2 code. Sadly the opposite has been realised. The public release of V2 code for Orion has the usable QSK capability reduced to around 20 wpm.

Just now Ten Tec is taking heat from users over a number of problems with the V2 operating code. Listing these in detail is beyond the scope of this article and is anyway something of a movable feast. Hopefully, the heat generated will provide the stimulus Ten Tec needs to correct the problems. I certainly would like to think so, though try as I may; I find it difficult to be optimistic. Having closely watched the development process over the last year as a beta tester, I have found it seriously wanting. Throughout development, bug fixes have been slow to come and their arrival has routinely heralded the accompaniment of several new bugs.

All is not as it should be in the code development process. I am not a Ten Tec insider, so I can only guess at just what the problem is. However, having made my career in the computer industry and having invested ulti-million pounds in software development projects during that time, I would say the signs suggest lack of a clear design specification and a similar lack of effective project management & review. As I said, I can only guess at the root cause of the malaise but its consequences are clear.

Orion 2 is a beautiful looking radio based on a robust hardware design. Sadly this is not enough. I would love to invest in upgrading my Orions to Orion 2, to take advantage of the colour display, improved roofing filters and faster Dragonball control processor. Instead, I will keep my money in the bank, because due to the change in Dragonball processor, Orion 2 cant run the V1 code and thats the only code that makes Orion any use to me at all.

I sincerely hope to be able to write another piece on Orion/Orion 2 in a years time, in which I can tell of the impressive progress made by Ten Tec in providing operating code that fulfils the potential of Orion. Today the school report style verdict would be:

Enormous potential  squandered.

Somewhere along the line, Ten Tec management appear to have taken their eyes off the ball. If Orion and Orion 2 are to achieve their potential, they will need to increase their focus and put some real muscle behind their code development process. Lets hope they do.

* Measured in independently conducted lab tests.

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html
---------------------------------------------------
73!

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## ua1osm

,   ,  , , ,      .    ,     765...   
1000 Field'a    .
     ,         .
 ,   -    .    .              ,     ...
     7800.
 ,     5  6     ,   940  950 .

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## UN7GM

2      ,        .     ,      .

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## RW3PS

. UN9GC.

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## 4Z5PM

,          ORION.

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## 4Z5PM

> .
> http://foto.cqham.ru/showphoto.php?photo=1403&size=big
>        .


   ,  ex. USSR   ...  ,     .  :Smile:

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## VE3EUT

?  ?         2  .
      ,  ARRL-   1  .

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## DRUID 3

To: RW3PS

 , ?   :Very Happy:   , ...

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## DRUID 3

...   ,       ...     " "  ???

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## DRUID 3

4Z5PM    Hamspirit  :wink: !
    ORION I  II.      , IP2  .  . DR3      (        ,   ,   ARRL     3- ,      " "     :Very Happy:  ) IP3  .    ,   .       . ... ,       ?   ,   .      (      :Very Happy:  ).   DR3    DR2.    ,    .

----------


## DRUID 3

:Very Happy:      ,     ,          ""...
  8O   ""      !!!???

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## UN7GM

-       .       ,   ,          " ". 
 ,      315/361 :-)

----------


## R9LZ

> ,    .


  ,   .       DSP?     ...

----------


## R9LZ

> ,    QRZ      .


-  .       ,      "".



> ""    ,   (, ,   )          .


     -     .  ?      ,   ,     ...  ...

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## 4Z5PM

150    .    ""   300    3...4 . .    ""  TEN-TEC      ,          .    " "  4- .      .  Elecraft        TEN-TEC,        .  " "    ,    . 

 .

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## VE3EUT

> 150    .    ""   300    3...4 . .    ""  TEN-TEC      ,          .    " "  4- .      .  Elecraft        TEN-TEC,        .  " "    ,    . 
> 
>  .


     , ..   2.                 :Wink:

----------


## UN7GM

QST  2. -  , - , - ,      ,   , .         :-)

----------


## R9LZ

,    .       ,      "" .     ,     .

----------


## RW3PS

*to UN7GM* ** 



> .      ,       ,  ,     .    2  .   QST-   Orion2,    .    ,       "" .


 .      ,   IC756/IC756PRO.
         IC,    .

----------


## VE3EUT

> isartw
> 
>       DSP based  ssb   .   ,      .    .
> 
> 
>   ,    .       ,      "" .     ,     .


   PC  . ,    PowerSDR     :Wink: 

         10BaseT   .

----------


## ut4za

, ...     ...    (     )    ...   SDR 1k   ( 1  )   (  )    500 . ,     1 $...
      ...???   ,  (    )...

     ""   2
   ,         DX 9000....

  ,   -    ,     .....

----------


## VE3EUT

http://www.n9vv.com/hamradio.html

   7 ? 

  - 756(     POS-).

10BaseT ,      ,            756pro*.

----------


## VE3EUT

,  :

1.     , .. 565- ?
2.      ?

  .          ..

         .
       ,    

http://www.cqham.ru/review/showproduct.php?product=498

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## RK6AUY

,     \(  ).
   ,         250    :Wink: 
   (  ,    ),   2.  ,   ,     - , , ,         .
 , ,    TS850 IC756PROII,    IC7800 FT9000DX    .

----------


## DRUID 3

,   ...  :Very Happy:  

  ,      *TenTec*      -  -.

----------


## UA1ANP

> ,  :
> 
> 1.     , .. 565- ?
> 2.      ?


1.  * 565.*
2.       * (    , ,  )!*

*      RW3DG!*

*      ,  !* 

********************  ********************  ***************
     ,   * 920* * -5 100* ,...    ,               "  "      .
    FT   (   *1,5* ,    -12 ).
*    ,*             .
       . 
  ,    *45*          .
          .
    -   ,
**       72 .
   ,      40-    80- ..   -** .
   200          * 57* *59+20*.
** -      :
**  .

 -* .* 
   ,   7800  !     .
   ,       , -       "" (   ).
**  -  ...   -3 -     . 
    -3    ....
    ,*             ...* 73    . 
**
********************  ********************  *****
http://forum.qrz.ru/showthread.php?t...ghlight=UA1ANP

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## UN7GM

,    ,       .       . 
      ,   . Dixi.

----------


## UR5LAM

Top band DX- - ON4UN       . 
,       "Low-band DXing". 
  ,   ,   ,  ,      .  
  .   :Sad:

----------


## DJ4MB

7  (  -.)
( ) -      , 7800 ( )  .
-    775,    .  - ,      600  !!  ,   ,  ( 30 !!!).      .
   ,  50      .
   735- ,  (   )  737 ( , ).
  (  , 565) ,   ""  
.   -   !,    
"".

----------


## VE3EUT

,      .     spacing  2  ,  500,  250,    ,                 765- 20  .      765-.  ,          . ,   , Omni VI +    ,    ,   ,          (CW/SSB)  765  .

----------


## VE3EUT

> 500    60-70  -  .     -  .     250  -   .           ,   CW  1  - . 500   ,     .


   ,   shape factor  500   60-70          9.      5      250 (  )      .  , 250      .  500     :Wink:

----------


## VE3EUT

,    ,  !
          ?  :Wink:

----------


## VE3EUT

...

----------


## ut7ub

> .
> http://foto.cqham.ru/showphoto.php?photo=1403&size=big
>        .


  , UT2UZ        "",     "  ".   .

----------


## VE3EUT

> DX,     , 765      ,      " ".
>      : RADIO FOR MONEY!
>   ,      -
>   ,    ,  .
> 
> -   200- FT_field : -?
> 
>  ,           USB  LSB,  ,      ,   765   SSB (toggle),      .   .


 ,  ,        .    940-   "200  FT_fielda"  -        940-   -   .




> -,       .


       6.             .




> -    ,              .       .


   GSM   SSB  :Very Happy: ,     .  ,        .     930-  .




> ,    , ,   - ,    ,   765    .


      .     ,    ,   .  ,  765 full break-in    ,    ,   .              FT-102.      6    97-98 ,  765   . 765   ,     .      6  . 




> , 765   .        " ",     . 
>     ,     ,       ,    ?
>          ,     ,    761  781,
>   .
>    7800       .    FT990.


       , you may think it's a treasure, another thinks it's trash.   ,        .    ,      .





> ,      -2,      3 .


   7  :-)   ,       7800  756pro  :Very Happy:

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## VE3EUT

> ten-tec  -,      -    *uzi*
>  ,  , !


  ? ..  1   ..  5.  2       9-12k$  7800  9000. ..   2       ,     .

----------


## VE3EUT

> . ,       DX   250        .     1-2 ,     10     .    .


,          -  :Wink:

----------


## VE3EUT

, .    -             :Wink: 
     250    .

----------


## VE3EUT

> DX QTH.      2-3    ,        2-3  .      ,        +40 -   ... Orion ...


  QTH,   ?
 ,    ?
   ?
    ?      Hang, Decay, Threshold ?
     45-      WEAK SIGNAL DX RECEPTION ... ?  :Wink:

----------


## VE3EUT

ua9cdc aka 8q7dv,       writeLog  . -      8q7    ,   UN7GM,   .
   .    ,   .
  ,         775   ' ,       ,           ,     ..      775-       MP1kMKV    dsp       .  ,   ,    .
           - 940-, 990-    .   .
    hang 0, decay   50db/s  treshhold 0.5-1 uV         1000-   .    . 
    775             - -       .
 ,     775-     1000D.  1000-        -  ,    '  . 
,     ON4UN,         .

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## VE3EUT

.  ,     tentec@contesting.co  m , UA9AYA, 8q7dv  -  ?

  ,    ,    ?     ?           ,  ?        775-  .
     ,   ADC/DAC ?              .
,   .       775-       ?   ,  ,        .
 ,   ,      -                  . 
     775-     .  DSP     .                    ,         .

----------


## VE3EUT

"  " ?      ?
             .                   . 
 - ADC/DAC       ,       .

    .     MP1kMKV        DSP  .         .
       1000D,      830-,     .
     830-       .  ,           ,       .       DSP   .

----------


## bhope

> DSP. 
>       ,           . 
> 
>                ,         . 
> 
>      .        . 
> 
>   ,           ,   .               ,       .
> 
>   ,              ,  IC-775. FT-1000D    IC-751A.


      .   -  .  2-3        -  2-3 .   - .      .  775 (  DSP  )    .    ,   .      (..  ).       .  751    .  .    ,  .          . 
 ,            . ,     ,  DSP  ,      20,    ,    -    .      .
, UA9CLB      ,      , ,          80  160 .        .       775.    .        ,   775  .

  -   ...      -  http://lists.contesting.com/archives.../msg00124.html      ,      8Q7.   .         ...

----------


## bhope

,     /   . ,         .        .

----------


## bhope

,    busted -      ...    ,      ,      :Smile:       (UA9CLB, UN9LW aka UP0L, RA9CKQ, RW6AN, UA9DD b 9V1BH),          8Q7         .        ,    .  ,      .   . 

      FT2000 
http://www.gofrc.org/cgi-script/CSUp...ber%2d2006.pdf 

  ,    .   ,    ,      CQWW.

----------


## VE3EUT

> ,    busted -      ...    ,      ,           (UA9CLB, UN9LW aka UP0L, RA9CKQ, RW6AN, UA9DD b 9V1BH),          8Q7         .        ,    .  ,      .   . 
> 
>       FT2000 
> http://www.gofrc.org/cgi-script/CSUp...ber%2d2006.pdf 
> 
>   ,    .   ,    ,      CQWW.


  :Wink:      -                 ,        .  ,            NR  AGC. 
                   .      ,        .
  ,      775-       ,    ?
                 . 

 FT-2000                           u-Tune  DCU     ,   ~3k$  :Wink:            .        pro3            .          . 
-  ,          .

----------


## VE3EUT

751        930, 940- .   940-    ,   .       :Wink: 

   ,   775-   .   DDS.   1000-    .

 565,          :Wink:    MP1kMKV        940-  MP1kMKV.           .       .

,        ? 565-      566   . 
      ?

----------


## VE3EUT

SSB MKV  ,        ,   . 765         ,   -   .
    ,    MKV,     qrz.ru    F-15  (  10 ),    .          FT-102  -(   ).                 .

----------


## VE3EUT

O,     ,             .  775   .  ,   ,        .       .             .     .
   830-  . YB1A  40-     .  830-     ,        .      . 
   NR,  AGC -  ,  .
 NR  3-,    ,   700-800,   300. RF gain  100.
AGC - hang 0, threshold na 0.37uV, decay  5db/s.  decay ,         ,               .             ,   .
 .          .
..    ,     830-   .
    830-      775-,   .        .
      .             ON4UN.

        - ""  ,                    .          ,    . 
                     NR            - .      .
                        -     NR   AGC.

,   775-,  .     :Wink:   .     .      . 

 ,    -      ,  ,   .  ,    .     :Very Happy:

----------


## RW3PS

> . 
> 1) 830      NF.


 ?      ?

----------


## RW3PS

UA9CDC,   Noise Floor (MDS).

----------


## bhope

,   - 127   - 135

----------


## RW3FY

isartw:

        , ,  ,  .      **.

,         ,     (         )    .    ? ,  ,          , , , -  .     ,     ,      ,    ?         .     .          *bhope*?    , ,  ,    .       40-   ,       . ..           ,  -    / .       , ,   ,    .      /. ..      ,      .  ,  *bhope*   ,     .     , ..     ,      ?         .        --- ,     DSP,    ,      .   ,       ,  "" ---   ,      . ,       ,     , IMHO       DSP   ---  /,       ,     . 

 ,   ,        10-,    ,  ,       .            10-  -.   40-, ,     .      .     40-   20- - .         --- ,     ,     (  40-  ,     ,       ).            .          ,   ,  /  ,    ,        .

       2. ,    *bhope*,     .        ,   -      ,     .   CQWW    2   7800 ---     ,    .

 bhope:

    ,    ,     ?

73!

----------


## RW3PS

,   .

----------


## bhope

. ...     http://www.sherweng.com/table.html
  ....   ...

----------


## VE3EUT

- .  -   ARRL-,   ,        ,    .
,     UN7GM      ?     ;-(
    ARRL-     775-       775-      8q7   MDS.  ,  '         .
 ,         .

----------


## VE3EUT

1000-  ,  DSP 16-    .                 . ,   9-1     ?
    ,   -   ,  .    ,   8q7    .
  ,   500   6(  500   )     -       1 ,  .   .        .       .
,   - -         ?         ,  -       .        .

     -       3-   :Wink: 
          .
             ,    MDS      -  ADC/DAC     .               ,   DSP              NR   .
 ,     ,                 .     1.372  .

----------


## VE3EUT

,      (    cq ww )  :Wink:      2.059d  1.372.
   ,    2000-,           5.            1000-        .   -     :Smile:  

  . ,         (           :Wink: ),                .        -           .

----------


## 4Z5PM

-:


{} -    .  ,  
     , {}  ,   ,
   ;      ,   
   ( {} 706MKIIG;    ).  
,   ARRL,       
( {; }  ""  ""  ,  
,     -   {}; 
  ,   ,    
{} receiver/.transceiver,    - ,  
  ).

  ,     {}   
    (    50)   {} .  
    -  ,       
 (,  30 +  ,     
 -  ,         ), 
   ,     
 (,   , -      
reesults   / ),    
  ,   -       -  
" "     .

    ,      ,  
      A/B   .    
  {}  ,     (Icom 7800 
3khz     ).        
" ."      
 , ,  anlysis   ,  
     - ,  ,  "" 
 ( ) {} .

 aplogize  ,    .  {}    
  ,   ,  {   }   15 (  63). 
  {}     . 

*!* 8O

----------


## bhope

.       -          ,    .         .   ,   isartw,      .

----------


## ham47

> ...  -    ...



?  100?   ?

----------


## VE3EUT

> ,  ,   ...
>   , R4C     ...    ,   ,       .    ?   ...    , -       ,    -Sorted by Dynamic Range Narrow Spaced)


  .                    7800  , . 
    __   ,   ,     ..       ,    .

  R4C,            .      .   .         .

----------


## RW3PS

> -      565   3000    1600-2300..


 .     .
   / ,   ,   .



> ,   .


     :wink:

----------


## UN7GM

,    R4C ' W8JI,   "",    ,   .   !       -250    -  UW3DI   0,00001 , IP3 + 100 dB,        ,    ,                .  W8JI       ,                 .       .

----------


## ua1osm

,    .  .   ,     ,  . ,       ,     ,     .   ...   .

     ,      
      ,   - .  .

        -   560,  OMNI-V        garbage.     765  -     .     !!!   !
     -353().     .

----------


## ua1osm

-   ,  ,  ...
    ,    , ,  ,    .

        765,  $990,   , .
         ,    1200.    WU .       .
  WD8DDW - , - . ,    ?
15 .  ,  ,     -  .           .
       ,        .

----------


## RK3KR

> .          7800 ????


TEN-TEC         KITa RX366 http://www.tentec.com/products/-Orio...Board-Kit.html

----------


## RA3BA

,    : "         ?".        ,     .   ,      , , ,    -  .    .     CW:         ,     ""      .  , ,      -   .   ,       ,         .       , ,  .    ,        . ,   .

----------

RN3QN

----------


## RA3BA

,    -  . ,       ?

----------


## rz3bw

> (  , 565) ,   ""  
> .   -  !,


   .  ,     Orion 2 566.         .   -     ,            ""!       !          ,     7 .
    ! ,      . 
 ,   DX-.                   QSO.       -  .
        -             .
    -  ,   ICOM -     .  YAESU       .   -     .
      -  .  -      -    ,    ,    -  .
,  ,  ,           .
  -         DX .
     (   ) -        -   .       50      SSB ,    .
   -  . 
.

----------

RN3QN, UA8U

----------

RA3BA

----------


## yur5553

- ,      .

----------

rz3bw

----------

?
 ,  ,  .  ? ?

----------


## R5ZQ

7300   .

----------


## UR5LAM

> -     270   -        -


 , Slope ()  ?

*  7 ():*




> .


    ?     AGC Off?

----------


## UR5LAM

> ,  .  Orion ,   ,    0,37   191,78 ,  -   .       .


  ,  3   . ,   TS990,    ,   ,      .

----------

2     (ts-990  Orion II)          ?        10?
  ...
  ,   ()       RF  ?   ?

----------


## UR5LAM

3,      (Slope)  ,       ,  ...     . , ,      ,   -.   ,   590/990-  ?   ?

----------


## rz3bw

- .  -  .  .  DX   .
   SUN SDR2  .

----------

Radio__HAM

----------


## RN3QN

> DX


     ,  ,   .

----------


## RU3KU

> ,


, -        ...   ,      .  :Evil or Very Mad:

----------

RN3QN, UA8U

----------


## UI8CM

-      (   ,  II ) .      ""   " " ,     -  ...

----------

UR5LAM

----------


## rz3bw

> ?


.  -  .   .
   -   , , .

----------


## Terry

> - .  -  .  .  DX   .
>    SUN SDR2  .


  SUN SDR,     .     .   .

----------

RN3QN

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